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Disharmony



Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 3012
Location: Buried in Minnesota dirt.
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MW2 got boring. I've been thinking about trading it in for Assassins creed 2.
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 8:04 pm
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breakreep
homophobic yet curious


Joined: 27 Sep 2004
Posts: 6627
Location: Fifth Jerusalem
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Disharmony wrote:
Not very often you get such a unique story [as Bioshock] in video games these days.


You're fucking kidding me! Arguments about the validity of intensifiers modifying the word "unique" aside (that's not my purpose here!):

Not only is that game's story far from one of the most unique video game stories, or even a particularly more unique video game story, it was not even particularly original or distinct (which implication are you going for?) among video game story lines the year that it came out.

There are two fucking things about this game that people always cite as special: It looks like it's old-timey (oh my god instant classic if the aesthetics look like 1920!); and you find out you're being manipulated in a kind-of-interesting way. The manipulation itself is not special at all. Oh wow code word programmed in your brain, holy shit this is new breaking territory! The presentation of that particular twist is all it had going for it.

None of which touches on the fact that no matter how "fresh" or "innovative" or "groundbreaking" or "genre-shattering" your game is, if it's boring as hell, you've just made a groundbreakingly boring game. I've always gotten the feeling this game gets so much hype just because the video game hipsters need something to coalesce around on a regular basis. Before Bioshock it was Psychonauts, which was at least funny.
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:39 pm
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breakreep
homophobic yet curious


Joined: 27 Sep 2004
Posts: 6627
Location: Fifth Jerusalem
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And at one point it was Katamari Damacy, along with a string of good RPGs! Why are the quirky games the hipsters love getting worse progressively? I know I'm not old enough to be a hater for no reason yet, so it's not me, it's the games. This I know.
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:41 pm
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breakreep
homophobic yet curious


Joined: 27 Sep 2004
Posts: 6627
Location: Fifth Jerusalem
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You know what everyone needs? A healthy dose of Halo: Reach. Some nice, refreshingly familiar, fun, and polished as fuck multi-million selling established franchise prequel. Everyone will play that, see how it (a quality story with fun gameplay and amazing presentation) compares to Bioshock (an aggravatingly bad story with okay gameplay and good presentation), and go right on bashing whatever they'd always bashed. My point is, Halo: Reach is going to be sooo good!
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:48 pm
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Oh Daesu



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 1848
Location: Vancouver
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Your solo-threading is awesome.
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:50 pm
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breakreep
homophobic yet curious


Joined: 27 Sep 2004
Posts: 6627
Location: Fifth Jerusalem
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Thanks!
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:02 pm
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Neuro
A champion of Kurtis SP


Joined: 19 Jul 2002
Posts: 7781
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Bioshock is dope as fuck

the whole feel of the game is dope

the second one looks like they made some nice improvements

this new one looks like a faster in your face bioshock as the first one you really didnt know what the hell was going on cause its all brand new this one takes what you learned and added new elements and made it a bitmore bonkers

i will check it soon
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:47 pm
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Disharmony



Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 3012
Location: Buried in Minnesota dirt.
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breakreep wrote:
Disharmony wrote:
Not very often you get such a unique story [as Bioshock] in video games these days.


You're fucking kidding me! Arguments about the validity of intensifiers modifying the word "unique" aside (that's not my purpose here!):

Not only is that game's story far from one of the most unique video game stories, or even a particularly more unique video game story, it was not even particularly original or distinct (which implication are you going for?) among video game story lines the year that it came out.

There are two fucking things about this game that people always cite as special: It looks like it's old-timey (oh my god instant classic if the aesthetics look like 1920!); and you find out you're being manipulated in a kind-of-interesting way. The manipulation itself is not special at all. Oh wow code word programmed in your brain, holy shit this is new breaking territory! The presentation of that particular twist is all it had going for it.

None of which touches on the fact that no matter how "fresh" or "innovative" or "groundbreaking" or "genre-shattering" your game is, if it's boring as hell, you've just made a groundbreakingly boring game. I've always gotten the feeling this game gets so much hype just because the video game hipsters need something to coalesce around on a regular basis. Before Bioshock it was Psychonauts, which was at least funny.
Ehhhh.

I can't really remember the last game that pulled me into the game so perfectly and absorbed me into the story line. Last one that comes to mind is probably Metal Gear Solid. There is just so much terrific and unique design to rapture, I could replay it over and over and find something new that I never noticed. This kind of love and care is equivalent to a mother bear adopting a baby kitten. You have to remember this is in the mind frame of a console gamer. I have no knowledge of the esoteric fan boy love of pc gaming narratives. Which I am sure may blow Bioshock out of the water.

I was bored when I first played it because at the time I didn't pay attention to the story, or wish to learn anything other then shoot, shoot, shoot. Once I let myself experience the game and take it all in, I appreciated it a lot more. I found myself anticipating every corner. Some people see a big, boring, swinging cock. I say, fuck yeah and then suck those balls.

The scene in Bioshock 1 where you find out Andrew Ryan is your dad, then you proceed to bash his face in. I found myself smashing buttons and hitting triggers to try and fight off what I was being forced to do. Anyone who stopped about an hour or two in should try picking it back up and hanging in, I'm sure you will be surprised. As the story moved on more things become available to you. It's like having sex for the first time can seem long, drawn out and whatever fun starts... is over within seconds. But if you stare at the tits, it makes it that much more interesting. And boy does Bioshock have a nice rack.
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:09 pm
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breakreep
homophobic yet curious


Joined: 27 Sep 2004
Posts: 6627
Location: Fifth Jerusalem
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Disharmony wrote:
Some people see a big, boring, swinging cock. I say, fuck yeah and then suck those balls.


Heh. Okay I won't argue with you. Just for that.

But I beat Bioshock. Let's make that clear. Why did I beat it when it did nothing but piss me off all game long? Because I bought it on the strength of unanimous game-of-the-year awards. Yeah, I know. I haven't done that since. Fuck reviewers. That was the last straw in the cradle that fell off the bough and broke the camel's back, analogous to the litigation he was subject to at the time for falsifying the results of cancer research into his product. Now he's a plumber.
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:14 pm
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breakreep
homophobic yet curious


Joined: 27 Sep 2004
Posts: 6627
Location: Fifth Jerusalem
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And oh my god! How is that golden dude for a shitty final boss? What the fuck? I finally reach the climactic battle of this godawfully boring game and it's an anticlimax? It was my own fault for being surprised!
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:19 pm
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Disharmony



Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 3012
Location: Buried in Minnesota dirt.
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breakreep wrote:
And oh my god! How is that golden dude for a shitty final boss? What the fuck? I finally reach the climactic battle of this godawfully boring game and it's an anticlimax? It was my own fault for being surprised!
Yeah, the last boss was too easy and boring as hell. Don't get me wrong, there were things I didn't like about Bioshock, but not enough to distract me.

Bioshock two gameplay and design is solid so far, it's just the story is heavily lacking. :(
Post Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:23 pm
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Mikal kHill



Joined: 29 Jun 2002
Posts: 6852
Location: http://mikalkhill.com
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I'm a little farther in, I think the story has gotten more "there." Not sure I like the new system for getting adam and saving little sisters, though.

-kHill
Post Thu Feb 11, 2010 1:13 pm
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Mark in Minnesota



Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Posts: 2010
Location: Saint Louis Park, MN
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I'll probably start playing BioShock 2 in the next week or so. It's sitting on my kitchen work table right now, waiting for me to finish beating Mass Effect 2 on Insane difficulty.

I really liked the aesthetics of the first BioShock. It wasn't the game of the year, but in my mind it was a welcome new franchise. The whole retro-futuristic/steampunk thing worked for me -- and reminded me in some ways of the Worlds of Ultima series from the early 90s. I thought the Little Sisters were delightfully iconic. I enjoyed the gameplay, in that I thought it struck a good balance between elements of a traditional FPS, light first-person RPG, and survival horror.

The shooting elements of BioShock weren't as polished as those in Halo or some of the other excellent solo-campaign shooters I've seen; in fact, except for the plasmid system the entire thing felt a lot like a throwback to an earlier style of FPS gameplay. The RPG elements were stunted, and the survival horror elements felt tacked-on in some places and first-you-must-find-a-shrubbery in others. But I simply can't say that any of this spoiled the game for me. I found Rapture a fascinating environment to explore and learn about, and my ability to interact with that environment immersed me more deeply in the experience than I might otherwise have been.

I think it's that immersive character of the game that made it such a positive experience for me, more than any one element surpassing the others. That and how satisfying it was to kill Sander Cohen both ways I fought him: he was a self-absorbed prick and that made him the kind of enemy I actually wanted to go out of my way to fight; usually I'm just trying to get past an enemy to advance the story. In video games, that doesn't happen often for me. Hmm... thinking about that makes me realize I should buy Bully: Scholarship Edition the next time I'm having a console gaming dry spell.

Anyway... the plot twist in BioShock was what it was, but I was having a good time well before I ever got to it, and my enjoyment of the gameplay actually went downhill shortly after that twist happened. OMG, post-hypnotic suggestions are going to kill you unless you can find the magic syringe full of cure! That felt tacked-on to me, and outside the game's core strength: letting me come to know the world I'm fighting my way through, as I'm fighting my way through it.

Thinking about it now, I can pretty much take every criticism I have of BioShock and apply it Dead Space. The thing is, with Dead Space I wasn't engaged by the world where the game took place in the same way that I was engaged by it in BioShock. I got to the end of Dead Space on normal difficulty and knew I had no reason to even attempt it on hard -- the gameplay didn't make up for the fact that the game was taking place somewhere that I didn't want to be, and was happening to someone I hadn't figured out how to care about.

breakreep, it sounds your largest problem with the first BioShock game is a lot like my problem with Dead Space. Impossibly heightened expectations didn't help, I'm sure, but it really seems to me like this setting and story just weren't for you. I'd chalk it up (as you have) to anti-Hot Topic/anti-hipster bias, but I share some of that bias, and besides that I think I'd be missing my own point. I'm reading through some of the older video game threads on the forum tonight, and things that break your suspension of disbelief seem to have fucked up a number of generally well-received games for you in the past.

Hardcore gaming is just like that, I think. It's such a time sink that if the gamer stops reacting to what's going on in the game and starts reacting to the game itself, continuing to play just starts to seem like an unjustifiable waste.
Post Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:59 pm
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leg.donor



Joined: 15 Dec 2003
Posts: 2756
Location: Portland, OR
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ive been too busy playing mag and heavy rain.

but none of you would know what im talking about, because xbox has shitty games.
Post Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:53 am
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futuristxen



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 19363
Location: Tighten Your Bible Belt
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Is Heavy Rain any good?
Post Fri Feb 12, 2010 1:17 am
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